puppets dancing to jamaican music

mike phirman: hey! kristen rutherford: hey! mike phirman: how's it going? kristen rutherford:it's going well. mike phirman: nice tohave everybody. how are you? kristen rutherford: i'm good. mike, this is my favoritepart of the show. the awkward staring into thecamera where everybody's like

are we-- it's a-- what? mike phirman: this is almost"that '70s show" convention of staring into the camera,but the entire episode. everybody delivered right tocamera the whole show. so welcome to #parent, or parentas nobody is saying. kristen rutherford: noone's saying that. mike phirman: i ammike phirman. also staring at you iskristen rutherford. kristen rutherford:hi, everybody.

mike phirman: and wehave guests down below as you can see. should we do introductions? do you have anything you wantto say before we bring everybody in? kristen rutherford: nope. this is our music episode. so all of our guestsare musical people. mike phirman: that's right.

so we have coming to thescreen right now, singer/songwriter, he is alsothe joco of joco cruise crazy, and maker of suchhits as "re-- your brains" and "the princesswho saved herself." please welcome jonathan coultonto your computer. jonathan coulton:hello everybody. it's nice to-- wait a minute. now i'm looking at paul. i don't want to look at paul.

paul sabourin: ha ha,i made noise. jonathan coulton: don'tmake noise. it's my chance tobe introduced. [applause] paul sabourin: whosaid make noise? what? ok, i'll make some noise. jonathan coulton: thankyou very much. thank you very much.

that's appropriate. hi, everybody. kristen rutherford:hi, jonathan. jonathan coulton: hi. kristen rutherford: andnow who's next? mike phirman: since he hasalready quasi-introduced himself, he is one of thefounding members of davinci's notebook, as well as halfof paul and storm. and is currently in productionof a program for the geek &

sundry youtube channel called"learning town," which i might be showing up in. please welcome-- kristen rutherford: spoiler. mike phirman: paul sabourin. paul sabourin: yay! hi, mike. hi, kristen. kristen rutherford: hi.

mike phirman: how you doing? paul sabourin: this isn'tawkward at all. kristen rutherford: it'sso awkward, isn't it? it's wonderful. mike phirman: you know what? because it feels almostclaustrophobic in a way. like everybody's inthe bathroom. like we're all just ina port-a-potty or something like that.

no one around anybody. but we're all kindof together. paul sabourin: we're in abathroom with cameras. kristen rutherford: yes. paul sabourin: andyou are forced to talk to other people. mike phirman: it's like we'reall in detention. this show is one big time out. kristen rutherford: it's"the breakfast club."

jonathan coulton: it's "thebreakfast club." except at it's night time. mike phirman: yeah. and definitely not least, itwould not have been lastly if it wasn't for paul jumpingin before. i would have put paul lastly. paul sabourin: why is everybodydogpiling on paul? mike phirman: but he is afounding number and guitarist for the band bad religion.

this show now has oodles ofstreet cred that we would never have had before,no offense to everybody else in the world. but also the founder and ownerof epitaph records and a friend of kristen's whois into music stuff. please welcome brett gurewitz,ladies and gentlemen at home. clap. kristen rutherford: yay! brett gurewitz: hi guys,thanks for having me.

it's fun to be here. kinda weird, but hi. hey, kristen. kristen rutherford: i see youthere, you're hidden. jonathan coulton: one of thethings that enhances the awkwardness is the poorlytimed applause. kristen rutherford:it really does. we need to invite once a weeka random person to come hang out with us that will bethe studio audience.

that will clap a few times, orask questions, or say it's too cold in the studiocan we turn up-- things like that. mike phirman: yep, that'sreally funny. [laugh track] mike phirman: thank youto google+ for adding sounds to the show. so i guess you guys knowwhy you are here. you are on the show becauseyou are musicians.

suddenly this is like a gameshow that you're going to have to fight now. i hope you realize whatyou've stepped into. very casual. but we have these guests becausethey are musicians. at one time they thought, i'mgoing to do music with my entire life. and here they are now becausethis episode is about music and the celebration andgeekdom they're about.

kristen rutherford: here'swhat this episode was birthed out of. when i had vivian, she was maybethree-months-old and i didn't know too many otherpeople who had babies. and i had an acquaintancewho had a baby that was six-months-old. and she's like, come over,we'll put the babies on a blanket together andlook at them. and i went over there and shehad her television set to one

of those cable channelsthat you can choose your genre of music. and she had it setto toddler tunes. so her house was full of allthis obnoxious kid's music. and i remember sitting thereand thinking why are you doing this? why are you playing thisobnoxious kid's music? you can be playing this babyanything you want. you still have timebefore your kid--

mike phirman: thisis your chance. kristen rutherford: yeah,this is your chance to play your music. you could just be playingyour music. why are you inflicting this onyourself before your kid turns to you and says, i would liketo hear this obnoxious song 10,000 times in a row? why on earth shewould do that? so that's what this is birthedout of was that moment of just

why would someone do that? and we wanted to talk toyou guys about music. about the music that you playwhen with you're with your children, when you are not withyour children, if there's a difference. your thoughts on just the musicthat's out there and good things to playfor your children. i was going to say good thingsor things that you think are good to play for your children,because i'm a member

of the departmentof redundancy. jonathan coulton: good things,or things that are not good but you think are good. that would be fine. jonathan coulton: no,i agree with you. the kids music thing, for awhile i tried interesting my kids in kids music. but really what they wanted tolisten to was just music. so kids sort of glom on towhatever stuff they like.

and it's weird what they like. i remember my daughter, evenwhen she was just learning to speak, really fixated on adixie chicks song called "goodbye earl," which is aboutmurdering an abusive husband. kristen rutherford: oh my god. jonathan coulton: and she reallydidn't know what the words were, but she loved thissong and would listen to it like 40 times a day. and that never would haveappeared on a kid's record

anywhere i think. brett gurewitz: right. mike phirman: i feel likekids learn things-- you will teach them somethingyou didn't plan on teaching them because a word willslip in there. even just something like-- well, i was going to tell youthe way i learned one word from a prince song. and i didn't knowwhat it meant.

but it has to do withlittle nicky? brett gurewitz: "darlingnikki." kristen rutherford:"darling nikki." mike phirman: yeah,"darling nikki." kristen rutherford: sayinglittle nicky is, like, whip your hair or something. that's something else? i don't know. mike phirman: i don'tremember.

kristen rutherford: what arethe kids listening to? mike phirman: but evennow, like you said, you have to be careful. if you play a song for a kid, itdoesn't matter if it's your favorite song in the world andyou think you can listen to it a thousand times. you are going to get tired ofit, because they will make you play it a billion times. i played "i get around." i waslike, i like "i get around" by

the beach boys. i can't listen to thebeach boys anymore. i can't. we'd listen to it every dayfor a solid three months, couple times a day. but if nothing else, it got usto have a conversation about what is a bad guy? because he said the badguys know us and they leave us alone.

i was like well they're guys whoare like going to get into things that they don't want to--they're guys that are-- and he goes, bad? yeah, ok, the guysthat are bad. that's pretty much it. kristen rutherford:guys that are bad. paul sabourin: my kids areolder, but from when they were younger there's sort of a flipside to that, i find. insofar as when my oldestdaughter was anywhere between

four months and 12-14 monthsshe cried all the time. she was the fussiest,colicky-est baby there was. and there were very fewsolutions that we could use. but one of them was playingshawn colvin's song "polaroids." for some reasonthat song clicked with her. and she would shut the heck upfor the duration of the song. and we could play it over andover and she would stay quiet most of the time forthe duration of it. so while i've heard that songa bunch of times, i have

nothing but gratitude andpleasant feelings for that song because i associate it withoh my god, thank you for keeping my kid quiet. kristen rutherford:that's funny. jonathan coulton: right. and you know, it's funny. when i was in college, that wasthe only thing that would make me stop crying waslistening to shawn colvin, the same thing with me.

mike phirman: brett,how about you? how old are your kids? brett gurewitz: well,i have two grown up kids, one who's 21. and he's in college. and an 18-year-old girlin high school. and i also have a toddlerwho's three. mike phirman: ok, so now at whatage did you feel-- with the older ones and with theyounger one-- at what age do

you start introducingthem to bad religion, things like that? do you feel like justwell, they're going to hear it anyway? brett gurewitz: i own tworecord labels, actually. and so there's alwaysmusic in our home. and my kids have heardeverything from tom waits to bad religion to mavis staplesin the house from the time they were born.

these are the artists i workwith all the time. not to mention listening tomusic for pleasure, but listening to musicfor business-- it's always in the home. and it's interestingto see the things they'll gravitate to. but i agree with what'sbeing said about children's music in general. there's some very goodchildren's music out there.

but in general, i think that youshould just play the kids good music. and you get to see everykid is different. sometimes really young kidssometimes like super energetic punk rock becauseit's so fast. and that's what i notice, itmakes them run around in circles and go crazy. brett gurewitz: but then ifind they connect to it. and it energizes them.

but it's not what theycome back to. it's not what they remember. there was a great comp called"gather around" that my wife gina and i loved. she might be joining me on thesame camera in a second. and it had artists likebob dylan, carole king, willie nelson. but all very simple songs thatwere really great and appropriate for kids.

and it was one of nico'sfavorites. and we played that forher for a long time. and i think it exposed her tosome really great performances by great artists. and it was music that we couldalso enjoy with her. mike phirman: that feelslike such a sign or a stamp of approval. if my son milo likes asong of mine, i would think that's huge.

because i feel like simpleis kind of a key there. because i know if you playedmedesky martin & wood, they're probably just going toturn into puppets and background music. they won't be able to followwhat's going on. but i think the simple thing,like it must be pretty hooky, or at least identifiable,something they can relate to. kristen rutherford:like the beatles. mike phirman: like the beatlesor beach boys.

brett gurewitz: ohyeah, the beatles are a staple, obviously. you know what my daughter nico'sall about right now are show tunes. my wife and her dad love "thesound of music," "the king and i," "singing in the rain." shedoesn't get that from me. but they love those shows. i like the shows, too. but it's not themusic i go to.

but nico seems to reallyadore that stuff. and the nice thing about thatis you can find clips of the best songs from all thosefilms on youtube. and she'll ask for her favoritesong from "the king and i," her favorite from "thesound of music." and she's captivated by that stuff. and we feel like she'sactually experiencing something that's quality. and it's not just pablum.

kristen rutherford: right. that brings up an interestingquestion, too. my husband and i, we intersectin some areas. but we have very differentmusical tastes. and the other day i was workingand my daughter came running in. she said mommy, daddy just toldme the most amazing story about a characternamed ordonna. and she's an amazing swimmer.

well, it turned out he hadshown her the video for "cherish" by madonna, somethingi never ever, ever would have done. i was like what? but you know what? now that's their thing, when hegives her a bath, they sing "cherish." and she pretendslike she's a mermaid. so as much as i waslike really? really, we're playingher madonna music?

i was like this is this amazingtime that they have together, where they playthis madonna song and she pretends to be-- or sorry, ordonna-- and pretends to be a mermaid. so have you ever had a runin where you're just like oh, not that? but then you have to sort ofcome to terms with it? has that ever happened?

or is it just me and ordonna? jonathan coulton: no, there wasa missy elliott song that my daughter latchedonto that had some inappropriate lyrics in it. i actually don't rememberwhat it was now. but yeah, it's happeneda few times. it's funny, when they're youngenough they don't understand most words. they're learning these songsby heart completely

phonetically. and it's kind of hilarious. because they're just sort ofskating overall all these difficult concepts and quoteunquote, "bad words." so i don't know. i tend not to worry aboutthat too much. because i feel like they have abuffer of protection, which is that they don't understandwhat is happening a lot of the time in the music.

i mean, you just have to worryabout them belting it out at the top of their lungsat the grocery store. mike phirman: yeah, right. yeah, exactly. kristen rutherford: becausethey will belt it out. jonathan coulton:oh, they will. kristen rutherford:i like j-pop. and so she will sing in phoneticjapanese at the top of her lungs and it isendlessly hilarious.

brett gurewitz: awesome. mike phirman: do you guys everplay any music for your kids that has some kind ofintent behind it? i know we have to eventuallymention baby einstein and things like that that are likei'm going to make my kid a genius by putting on mozart. and then of course, people aresuing because they're not necessarily geniuses becausethey listen to little mozart. but do you ever put on musicwith an intent other than just

enjoying it-- likesome reason? like i'm going to put onclassical to focus. or you could put on the jbsbecause i want them to have some funk in them. is there anything that you,like, i'm putting this on for this reason? brett gurewitz: yes. kristen rutherford:next question. brett gurewitz: no, no.

i mean, i try to cultivategood taste in my kids. so yeah, i played thema lot of beatles. i've always played them stones,i play them all my favorite stuff, dylan,springsteen, waits. i try to expose them to greatmusic by great artists constantly in the hopes thatsomething will sink in. i mean, i've even playthem daft punk. i have pretty eclectic taste. but i don't know ifit has any effect.

because i actually have theexperience now of having two grown up kids. and i did that for them. and my son basically listensto black metal. and my daughter listensto bieber. so it didn't help. not like there's anythingwrong about that. kristen rutherford: i guess at acertain point your children, when they're teenagers--

and remember, i havea three-year-old. so i don't know what thehell i'm talking about. but i imagine when they'reteenagers, you kind of don't-- i mean, i would like herto little some of the things i like. but part of being a teenageris rebelling against your parents and not listening to themusic that they listen to and finding your own thing. my dad offered to buy my thomasdolby "golden age of

wireless" record from mejust so he could put a razor blade to it. and i was like, i'm going toplay this a hundred times a day instead. so maybe that's a part of it. paul sabourin: youcertainly can't. i'm not saying anything that'srocket science or anything. but you put stuff on andyou hope for the best. but obviously you can'tprogram your kids.

and you can't really force yourtaste or a particular taste on them. they're going to take from itwhat they take from it. for both my kids, we come backto the beatles again just as an example. i tried play some beatlesfor them when they were quite young. and they were ok with it. but they didn't reallysuper latch on to it.

and then a number of yearslater they actually-- my daughters are three yearsapart-- but at the same time, they came back to the beatles ontheir own through "beatles rock band." that was when "rockband" was really at the height of its powers, certainlyin our house. and they started playing itjust because it was "rock band," here's some moremusic to play on that. and they really, just over thecourse of a few weeks, suddenly started appreciatingthe songs for the sake of

listening to the songs. so eventually, hopefullyat some point it all comes around. but i've never approached ittrying to force particular choices on my kids. i mean, just as brett said, myyounger daughter listens to pretty much every disney popstar there is right now. [? kevin ?] lovato and selena gomez.

she's not so much into bieber,but all the bieber-like-- kristen rutherford:bieber-like? hey, watch it. paul sabourin: and you cansay what you will about those kind of things. the thing i try to the extent oftrying to be a good parent about it, she's smart enoughto know that they're not necessarily really goodmusic, per se. but you try and at leastdo things like

appreciate the craft. i never would have listenedto this stuff by choice. but just being in the car whenshe puts these things on, occasionally one of thesethings will come on. and i'm like you know what? this is a really well-craftedpop song. whether or not the lyricsare incredibly deep or i particularly care for it,i can really respect the craftsmanship.

the work that went into makingthis as incredibly catchy as it is. mike phirman: that actuallybrings up an interesting question. since you guys are all veryfamiliar with how songs are made, at what age do you guysbreak down songs and like, you know what, let's go in andrecord a basic song? if you like "i get around,"let's record it real quick. let's make a little--

it's not because i'm great-- but here's what's goingon in this song. there's a drum, there'sguitar, there's bass. do you guys do that? how into the music do youwant to get with them? jonathan coulton: i tend tosort of soft peddle it. i mean, both my kids havemusical aptitude. but my experience with comingto music was very-- i took piano lessonsfor awhile.

and it was never as much funas it was when i was just sitting down at the piano tryingto figure out songs that i wanted to play. and so much of my relationshipto music comes from just exploration by myself. and so i don't want to ruinanything for them by forcing them to do anything butthey aren't actually interested in doing. that sad.

occasionally my daughter willsay i want to record. i have a great idea for a songand i want to record it. so she goes into the booth andi put a little drumbeat. and she sings tunelessly forabout a minute and a half. kristen rutherford: friday,friday, friday. jonathan coulton: yeah. and then i add somestuff to it. and it's fun. but i'm always very conscious ofnot wanting to put anything

in front of them that theydidn't actually ask for it. because it's just sticks betterwhen it's you deciding to learn a thing. it just sticks better,i think. mike phirman: i guess the onlything i feel like is i didn't take piano lessons. i just kind of played byear and everything. and there is a part of me, mydad even said, i tried it get you to do piano lessons.

it would have been great. i always thought, if you have asymphony in your head, this will be the way to get it out. you'll know how to do it. and now, i thinklike anybody-- jonathan coulton: iwish they had made me take piano lessons. yeah, i know. brett, did you do any?

like, did you, i'm going to makesure you guys learn how to play guitar? i want you to learnan instrument. did you do anything like that? brett gurewitz: i'm sort of inthe same camp as jonathan. i didn't want to pushmusic on my kids. i didn't grow up in amusical household. but music was my firstgreat love. and it remains thatto this day.

and i felt like the kids shouldcome to it themselves. that being said, they grewup in recording studios. they grew up in rehearsalstudios. they grew up in therecord label. so they had access to it. and there was always musicin their lives. but there's a lot tobe said for a kid finding their own path. i think their lives havebeen enriched by music.

i even did attempt to givethem piano lessons. but i wasn't a strictparent about that-- so far. and maybe it will be differentwith nico. nico seems to love music. we have a piano in the home. she sees me singingand playing music. i sing to her at bedtime. i guess all the normal stuff.

but we'll see. i think you have to letkids find their path. does anybody have an album forwhen the kids are very small that they recommend? for instance, i have one thatwe have listened to almost every single nightfor milo and eli. you know how they say if you puton a song, and you have a routine, and it gets them toknow what's coming next? and then by the time they hitthe bed, they know that they

fall asleep. and it's really easy, right? so our album, it's called, ithink, "hushabye." it's covers of willie nelson done reallysoft, but so well done. i've now heard that album. it's got to be like a thousandtimes, literally a thousand times, and i'm nottired of it all. so that's a great album fora little sleep time thing. do you guys have any cdsanybody watching should

take a listen to? paul sabourin: "polaroids"by shawn colvin on repeat, 800 times. jonathan coulton: there's analbum by jason falkner called "bedtime with the beatles,"or something like that. and that's for reallytiny babies. there is no singing. it's just like lullabies playedon the softest little plinky instruments.

but it's really beautiful. it's tastefully done. and jason falkner'sa pop genius. so it's great to havehim behind that. and in those countless hourswhen you're rocking back and forth with a stupidbaby in your arms. kristen rutherford: babiesare so stupid. they are. jonathan coulton: they areso stupid at that age.

paul sabourin: butthey're dumb, they don't know anything. jonathan coulton: theydon't know anything. but you get to listen tobeatles music while you're doing it. so it's kind of nice. kristen rutherford: whatabout you, brett? brett gurewitz: well, i'llmention the one i mentioned before, which was a compilationcalled "gather

around." it's got a lotof wonderful music, maybe not for a baby. but it's perfectfor a toddler. the other thing that we dois we play lots and lots of music for nico. and we've started puttingtogether playlists of her favorite songs. so like i was saying before,there's "singing in the rain." there's songs from musicals.

and you can put togetherplaylists on various programs. obviously there's itunes. and we have a lot ofitunes playlists. but we have spotifiedplaylists. i'm also a user of rdo. being in the business i'm in,i'm signed up to every damn music service in the world, ofcourse, because i have to see what they all do. but spotify playlists of a kidsfavorite songs can be

phenomenal. because suddenly they're justthrilled with every single track that comes out. kristen rutherford: dude, i wasat your house last week. and i think gina put on whateverit was that had the mix of "singing in the rain."and it had, like, "singing in the rain." but also, like,"cinderella" and "king and i." and i was like, that's justthe greatest mix. my god!

brett gurewitz: but it alsohad "lucy in the sky with diamonds." kristen rutherford: yeah. it was really good. you could sell those mixes. mike phirman: the greatest iswhen you're listening to a genre of music and thensomebody like a comedy musician, like paul, i'll belistening to irish music or something like that andthen all of a sudden,

what's the irish jig? paul sabourin: well, we have asong called "another irish drinking song," which is justa litany of all the people who've died. we're ruining genres,one at a time. mike phirman: as we say,we're not making music. we're taking music. kristen rutherford:very noble. paul sabourin: it's more of acalling, really, than a job.

kristen rutherford: wehad a music teacher. i used to take vivian tothese music classes. and the woman who ran theclasses was so good. and there's like a10-session class. she'd give us a mixed cd thathad a lot of "the music in me" stuff on there. but she'd mix it up. it would have that song me,me, me, but then the next track would be joan jett andthe blackhearts going yeah,

me, yeah me. and her mixes we're just-- don't tell any of my friendsthat i went to college with, but these are the best mixtapesi've ever been given. they just went to places, like,all of a sudden you'd be listening to jimi hendrix rightafter you were listening to a song about bangingpots in the kitchen. it was really, reallysomething else. we do that a lot in our house.

we have a lot of playliststhat we pull up. i have a car list. and the car list getsshifted around. and i'm always burning new carscds and stuff like that, because i like living in 2004. jonathan coulton: i carefullycurated a playlist of bedtime songs, low-key, mellow songs. there's a little sonos box nextto the kids' bed, and-- paul sabourin: is thatlike a robot?

jonathan coulton: what's that? is it like a robot? paul sabourin: isthat a robot? jonathan coulton: it'sa robot, yeah. it's a music robot. kristen rutherford: whoa, shock,what happens when that robot becomes sentient? what are you going to do? jonathan coulton: it's notgoing to become sentient.

it has its own music choicesthat you don't want to listen to. kristen rutherford: i didn'tprogram that into that robot. jonathan coulton: theylistened to the mix for a long time. and they sort of absorbed a lotof that stuff, which was fun to watch. and now my daughter has decidedthat when she is falling asleep, she wants tolisten over and over again to

"three is the magic number." brett gurewitz: nice. the de la soul? jonathan coulton: yeah, thede la soul version. kristen rutherford: wow. jonathan coulton: get rid ofthe playlist, just put that song on repeat. brett gurewitz: that'sa good song. kristen rutherford: thatis a good song.

i like that album. jonathan coulton: i don't knowhow many times i could listen to it in a row beforei'd want to hear at least something else. brett gurewitz: play her "oneis the loneliest number." jonathan coulton:yeah, exactly. kristen rutherford: whichversion, though? the amy mann versionor the original? brett gurewitz: the threedog night, i would say.

kristen rutherford: threedog night, yeah. mike phirman: was "one is theloneliest number" done by three dog night? brett gurewitz: uh huh. mike phirman: that's irony. and we're into math songs. so, they might be giants. folks, what do you thinkabout slipping in-- what a perfect segue.

i'm going to give myselfa little bit of this. what do you think about-- paul sabourin: there it is. mike phirman: --songs, andalbums, and stuff that you can slip in the brainy stuff withgood music behind it? but i'm talking, of course,about they might be giants. which you don't haveto be a parent. you don't have to havekids around. you don't have to have kids atall to enjoy tom lehrer.

things like that are sneakyways to learn. do you guys aspire to writingthat kind of stuff? or do you have any motivationslike that? paul sabourin: wish i did. mike phirman: have you guysever thought about doing-- i'm actually kind of working on,as we were saying, taking music versus making it. i'm working on a kids' ep, alittle thing with kids' music. but i cannot take it seriouslybecause i, like i said at the

top, there's kids' musicthat drives me crazy. no offense. good job to everybody, likethe wiggles and such. cool, good for you guys. awesome. but i can't listen to it. it drives me crazy. and it's also in, i think, thecomedy guy nature to want to-- all right, so what'sthe joke there?

i'm not just going to record asong that's like, literally, the banana said whoops. and it fell to the ground. i'd lose my mind. jonathan coulton: well,that's terrible. kristen rutherford: thatreally was terrible. paul sabourin: mike,where's the joke? come on. jonathan coulton: bananasaid whoops.

first of all, bananascan't talk. and second of all, it'snot the bananas that fall to the ground. people slip on the bananas. kristen rutherford:science is flawed. mike phirman: where do you goto get your ideas, man? where i go the bananastalk, man. kristen rutherford: you'remaking songs for children of the '70s who are on acid.

brett gurewitz: comeon, you guys. the banana said whoops whenthe guy slipped on it. that's what happened, paul sabourin: well,that makes sense. yeah, that makes sense, sure. mike phirman: i didn'tsay he was alone. i just said he said whoops. but the point being, soi'm making this thing. but i can't help but mock it.

which i don't know howit's going to go. you know how it goes,we'll see. but of course, there is thatpart that's kind of like, oh, it'd be nice to makea thing that kids actually learn something. not that they're going tonecessarily memorize the elements and all thatkind of stuff. kristen rutherford: i know thepreamble of the constitution from "schoolhouse rock."

paul sabourin: yeah, totally. kristen rutherford: i know it. it's served me no use. but you know what has? there was a song called "50nifty united states" that listed the states inalphabetical order. and i know all the statesin alphabetical order from that song. so when my kid is singing thatthere are seven continents,

she knows all the continentsnow from that weird little ditty. i think it's a defensemechanism. but i can listen to signa million times. i go to another place. she will want to listento a song 7,000 times. and i just go away. that's the only wayi can describe it. because i'm kind of like,hey, i know what it's

like to be on a jag. so we're going to keep hittingrepeat on this. and it's fine. you let me know when you'veworked this out. brett gurewitz: you know, iknow exactly what you're talking about. and i think it is something todo with toddler's brains and carving new neural pathways thatare going to be really great for them.

it's not that they have ocd. something's happening that'sactually healthy and natural. but i'll tell you somethingfunny in our household. because my background before iwas doing my label was i was actually a mixer and arecording engineer. and so those of us other guys inhere who've done that stuff know that in order to do that,you have to be able to hear a song 10,000 times. mike phirman: oh, yeah.

brett gurewitz: but what willhappen is, i'm sympathetic to my toddler daughter. here's my wife. kristen rutherford: gina! brett gurewitz: when nico willget a favorite song, i will literally put it in itunes, andput it on repeat, and just play it for her. and i can handle it. i feel that my profession hasdesensitized me to that.

i have no problem hearinga song 500 times. kristen rutherford: though,what's my excuse? like, what's wrong with me? mike phirman: i have a songthat's with a group i'm with called hard n'phirm. and we do a song about pi. and the chorus is justthe numbers, like 180 digits of pi. and so after we do a show,people would be like how did

you possibly memorize that? and it's the same answer. because i engineered it, andmixed it, and sat on it for so long, eventually i didn'teven have to try. it's just in there. kristen rutherford:it's in there. brett gurewitz: but when you mixa song you have to hear it for eight hours straight. so i guess that's whywe're immune to it.

gina gurewitz: that's easy-- mike phirman: hi, gina. gina gurewitz: --for you guysto say, because you didn't have to just sing "moonriver" 18 times. kristen rutherford: ladies andgentlemen, gina gurewitz just back from putting nico to bedand apparently singing "moon river" 18 times in a row. brett gurewitz: they just putyou in the camera, look. gina gurewitz: what?

brett gurewitz: kristen'sfriend and-- gina gurewitz: me. kristen rutherford: and gina. paul sabourin: side note, mike,before my older daughter even knew who you were, sheended up finding "pi" somewhere online. i mean, i knew who youwere but i hadn't played it for her. she just found it online, likekids do, and managed to

memorize all of the lyrics toit before she ever met you. mike phirman: yay! paul sabourin: which is, i'mpretty sure, a skill i appear to have lost. like that's something i'vefound interesting. mike phirman: memorizing? paul sabourin: not memorizing,per se, but just sort of listening to popular musicor whatever i'm listening to at the time.

and the lyrics reallyjust sinking in without even trying it. like, oh, i suddenlyknow all the words to this entire album. mike phirman: right. paul sabourin: maybe i don'texercise that skill as much as i don't listen to nearly asmuch music in general as i used to when i was younger,because you have a lot more time then.

but i'm afraid i'mjust getting old and can't do it anymore. but that sort of fascinatedme about both my kids. and i don't know how youguys have found. but your capacity to just suckin and remember lyrics to stuff, maybe it's likelearning a language. maybe it's easier whenyou're younger. kristen rutherford: you knowwhat helps with that? listening to a song 100times in a row.

paul sabourin: well, yeah. mike phirman: yeah, yourkids are older. so you don't have to listento the exact same song. jonathan coulton:this is true. paul sabourin: oh, you'dbe surprised. kristen rutherford:probably not. gina gurewitz: that's true,brett's teenage kids ruined the white stripes for us,and the buzzcocks. just hearing it blastingout of their rooms.

brett gurewitz: there'san example. i turned my kids on tothe buzzcocks when they were small children. and then they later grew to lovethem so much that now i can't listen to them anymore,because they just burned it out. mike phirman: hey, wehave a couple of people from the internet. i'm keeping an eye on thetwitter interactions.

i don't know how to pronouncethis correctly, but i'll try it-- soriah betyeah says that"we listen to dr. horrible in the car. and the kids love it. and it starts interestingconversations," interesting, "about 'lassie.'" and then maxwell mud says, welike putting on various putumayo cds so they geta taste of world music.

we also play zeppelin, pixies,phish, et cetera, too. those are great cds,by the way. putumayo, good backgrounddrums and just cool world music. i'm huge about those. those are great. kristen rutherford: sometimesworld music though makes me feel like i'm in a newyork city subway waiting for a train.

mike phirman: maybe that'sthe california part. i don't get that. i mean, i know it. kristen rutherford: someone islaughing with me because they know exactly what it's like. jonathan coulton: are youtalking about the guys who play the bamboo flutes? kristen rutherford: yeah, thebamboo flutes and the steel drums, and you're just like,please, i just want my 9 train

to come so i can go home. brett gurewitz: no comment. gina gurewitz: i tried to getkristen to go to the summer sounds series at the hollywoodbowl with me. and she was like, um,reggae music? kristen rutherford: no, idon't like reggae music. no. i am not relaxed at all. i am not.

i just don't get this. it's way, way toorelaxed for me. i listen to a lot of j-pop. i mean, what else do youneed to know about me? and i know i'm complainingabout kids' music. but i'm like let's listento capsule and perfume. i don't make any sense. but i didn't claim to. paul sabourin: long car ridesin our family always seem to

end up reverting back toeveryone singing along full volume to the entire "jesuschrist superstar" original concept album. jonathan coulton: oh, man. kristen rutherford: oh, wow. jonathan coulton: thatis the best. paul sabourin: isn't it? jonathan and i have been intour bands in the past together where we've subjectedstorm, who did not grow up

with the proper training voicethat jonathan and i did, and just the two of us just-- brett gurewitz: is thatthe one with ian gillian on lead vocals? paul sabourin: yes. jonathan coulton: yes. brett gurewitz: ilove that one. jonathan coulton: i've foundmyself in a number of situations where it just comesup that there are a number of

people there who reallylike that album. and somebody will start singinga snippet of it. and the other ones willimmediately join in. and you can get a good 15 or20 minutes in before people start to get really annoyedand make you stop. brett gurewitz: i like that[inaudible] thing. paul sabourin: i think of it aslike the musical equivalent of quoting "monty python"in a room full of nerds. jonathan coulton: oh, totally.

but you can't stop yourself. paul sabourin: no, you can't. jonathan coulton: once somebodystarts going, you just want to go therewith them. paul sabourin: yep. mike phirman: let's see, we havefrom brett glass, "ask paul how has his career as acomedy musician writing ribald lyrics affected his daughters. has its corrupted them?"

paul sabourin: corrupted them? actually, thanks to be thecalming influence of my wife, i think they've managedto come up ok. i mean, they've come up withpretty healthy senses of humor, which we've triedto foster in them from very early on. and as the question mentions, alot of our songs have adult content or themes. and within reason.

we never really try tomask them from it. i mean, obviously i wasn'tplaying songs filled with expletives when they were threeor anything like that. but once we felt like theywere mature enough to understand daddy doesthis for a living. and there are words herethat daddy uses in a specific context. and they're not necessarilywords that you should repeat to your teacher or friendsor at school.

and luckily, they were prettymature at a you age, both of them were. so i was lucky in that regard tonot have to worry too much about that. jonathan coulton: i think youshould call your next album songs filled with expletives. i think that's a greatalbum title. paul sabourin: i'm goingto write that down. songs--

kristen rutherford: just don'ttype it, because the sound of your typing is like godzillacoming through the [inaudible]. mike phirman: speaking of, bythe way, musicals and things like that, there is a great showthat i want to mention. now again, my kids are veryyoung so this applies to them. and there's a show called--well, one, there's the yo gabba gabba. if you're looking for a showthat has music in it, that is

a double-edged sword. because it is bothmusical and fun. but it is also ear worms thathave fangs and teeth, and just eat your brain, and hangin there all year. paul sabourin: angryear worms. mike phirman: what's that? mike phirman: very angry earworms that tell you to try it, you'll like it, overand over and over. but not a bad show.

but also, there's onethat got cancelled. but it's one of these shows thatgot cancelled before it won emmys and stuff, called"jack's big music show." and if you haven't seen "jack'sbig music show," it's a great show. paul sabourin: they'rea great show. mike phirman: yeah,it's so cool. it's muppeteers from "sesamestreet," and they have on justin roberts and laurieberkner and proper kids'

musicians like mine. but the whole thing is music. and it's really done well. and whenever they play guitar,their hands actually move in the right way. paul sabourin: nice. mike phirman: they go to atom, it'll play a tom. like, it's that kindof good show. mike phirman: not like iactually really care.

and i think you canfind it on amazon. and i think they rerun itsometimes so if you set a dvr to record it. paul sabourin: phineas and ferbhas some really wonderful music, i find. for a television show,certainly. i enjoy that a lot. also, jonathan and i havehad this discussion. i am constantly tickled todeath by the songs on

"adventure time," whichare all kind of deceptively simple. and you have to worry aboutraising your kids to become stoners, i guess, maybe,through osmosis. mike phirman: and they're yogabba gabba acid friends. paul sabourin: yeah. but so many of the songs on thatshow are just wonderful little deceptively clever andjust wonderful little pieces of whatever.

i just like them alot, how's that? jonathan coulton:agree strongly. brett gurewitz: brett,any shows? do they watch musicalsof any kind? do you have music videos on? or what kind of stuff? jonathan coulton: do you pretendthat the "sound of music" ends with thewedding and before the whole nazi part?

brett gurewitz: i'lllet my "sound of music" expert comment. gina gurewitz: yes, she onlywatches the songs. like all of the narrative,she's just not interested at all. so we skip through "the kingand i" from the song about whistling to "getting to knowyou." so the whole film is condensed into like13 minutes. it's great.

brett gurewitz: but see lovesthe songs, and she loves the way that they're connected tothe picture in the story. and she makes up storiesabout them. and they seem to stimulate herimagination a lot, even though the plot to those filmsare adult-themed. and they're really fartoo advanced for her. but she just loves the lushcinematography and the sound. she really gets into it. kristen rutherford: but that'sreally interesting about

musicals is that a lot of themdo have incredibly adult themes, or just adultsituations. especially the older ones,the music is so, so good. i mean, i loved "pajama game"when i was a kid. and then as i got older i waslike, oh my god, these are about workers fightingfor money. and it's a completely differentlevel that i didn't realize when i was acting outthe songs in my living room. there's a lot of really goodmusicals out there that would

be good to introduce kids to. or just introduce them to musicthat's good music and not necessarily pop music. that's like i played "thewall" probably-- see, i started a lot of stuffway too early. i get very like yeah, yeah,yeah, here, here, here, and just try to dump all thisstuff on my kids. for instance, like from previousepisodes where i showed a one-year-old a clipfrom "the hulk" thinking oh,

he'll dig this! and like, no, you don't showthat to a little kid. i know that now. but i showed him "the muppetmovie" at, like, age 18-months or something like that,19-months, and thinking oh, an animal gets big he's probablygoing to freak out and stuff like that. and he didn't really. but i think he just didn'treally catch on to any of it.

so i feel like i should goback and show him again. and then a couple years later,show him again to get the next level in there. and then finally, when he's like20, be like dude, you got to see this movie now thatyou're an adult. now it's going toblow your mind. jonathan coulton: boy, he'sreally going to love that movie by the time you're done. mike phirman: so we have acouple questions that came in

earlier today. one is from collin surname. and it says, "which of them hasthe longest word in one of their songs?" does anybody claimto have a very long word in any of your songs? paul sabourin: thelongest word. brett gurewitz: i don't know? how do we-- gina gurewitz: by syllables?

brett gurewitz: by letters? paul sabourin: at the end of"opening band," we sing the word hello for 34 seconds. does that count to holdthat note that long? jonathan coulton: no. brett gurewitz: that'sthe longest note. kristen rutherford:longest word, or-- paul sabourin: defineyour terms, people. define your terms.

brett gurewitz: my group hasthe word rectilinear in it. can anyone beat that? jonathan coulton: that'shard to beat. kristen rutherford: that'sa big one, yeah. paul sabourin: i can't believejonathan doesn't have the longest word. come on, jonathan. mike phirman: mandelbrot, isthere anything in that? jonathan coulton: no,i don't think so.

and i never finished"neumonoultramic roscopicsylacoblacanaconiosis."that song, i never finished that one. mike phirman: what? you just did. how much more can it be? kristen rutherford: and nowyou've lost this competition. paul sabourin: or how aboutthis, does "pi" count? mike phirman: no.

jonathan coulton: no,it's not a word. it's a number. brett gurewitz: for a number,pi would count. mike phirman: that's a ratio. kristen rutherford:it's not a word. it's a ratio. thank you, mike. it's all bent out of sheep. angry nerds are the best.

mike phirman: i can't believewe're even discussing this. i mean, good lord. paul sabourin: that'sgood, said mike. mike phirman: actually, brettshould be the king, because he has the longest word. kristen rutherford: puton your effect. brett gurewitz: hold on, me andgina need mustaches then. kristen rutherford: no,if you have two people you can't do it.

it's terrible. brett gurewitz: you can'tdo it-- only one of us? ok, i'll have the moustache. gina gurewitz: no,give it to me. kristen rutherford: you can't. brett gurewitz: watch, see,i'm doing it to me. kristen rutherford: gina,if you move your head in front of him. yes!

jonathan coulton: youstole his moustache! mike phirman: stole hismoustache, wow. i've got to say, i've onlyseen videos of it online. and i've only seen thedvd in the fry's electronics goods store. but there's a thingcalled animusic. might be worth checking outbecause it is maybe some of the most awesome 3d animation. i'm going to go pickit after this.

because, as i say, i realize ireally should have that and have it on the background. it's very weird like syntho. it's like electrosyntheticmusical sounds. but it's very cool. it's crazy 3d animations thatare all-- oh, we lost paul. really? kristen rutherford:we lost paul. and brett and gina are justpassing a tiara back and forth

between them. jonathan coulton: i'mlistening, mike. i'm listening. mike phirman: animusicis really cool. you should look at animusicfor your geeky kid. that's what i'm trying to say. kristen rutherford: the bestpart about this show is all the people that are up way toolate past their kids are all like, oh my god.

jonathan coulton:i'm so tired. kristen rutherford: i'mtired, oh my god. all of us, it always descendsinto all of complaining that we're tired. mike phirman: i feel like thereare two things i want to ask and talk about real quick. we'll do this one first. any apps or ipad stuff foryour mobile phones, or computers, or anything like thatthat you guys recommend,

music-wise. for instance, there's "klimba."just called "klimba," k-l- i- m-b- a whichis good for the little kids. milo digs that. one called "sound shaker" thatwas recommended on episode one of this very program,which is awesome. brett gurewitz: gina'swriting these down. gina gurewitz: uh huh. mike phirman: it's so cool.

i wrote it down from thatepisode and went and got it. "sound shaker." it lets youcreate little balls and then they fall down. the longer you hold onto it, itgives it a different sound. and then once they're allon the screen, you just roll it around. and it becomes a littlewind chime. they just bling intoeach other. kristen rutherford: that'sa really app.

actually, i think it'sby tickle tap. and tickle tap, a lot of theirapps are where you can buy a package of three or fourof their apps. and "sound shakers"is on there. and they're a reallygood company. mike phirman: and one calledcambox, which you take pictures of yourself. you just basically go-- [spitting noises]

mike phirman: right? and then you assign thoseto different buttons. and it happens immediately,and then you have a drum machine of you doingthose things. it's really cool. brett gurewitz: thatsounds cool. kristen rutherford: it is. jonathan coulton: it's great. mike phirman: that's cambox--

c-a-m-b-o-x. what do you guyshave with your kids? brett gurewitz: my kids arepretty much just running logic, pro tools. mike phirman: any good plug insthat they can recommend? brett gurewitz: there's a lotof good plug ins out there. mike phirman: i justneed a good eq. brett gurewitz: i like thenative instrument stuff. all the musiciansare laughing. the "funkmasterz midi setfor superior drummer

2.0" is quite excellent. mike phirman: i've beenpushing that so hard. i don't want to take anydrummers out of work, but man, "superior drummer"by toontrack. jonathan coulton:it's a good one. brett gurewitz: we bought an appcalled "duck duck moose" for nico when she was-- gina gurewitz: no,no, "musicalme." kristen rutherford:"musicalme," yeah,

that's a great app. brett gurewitz: that'sa good one. kristen rutherford: yeah, duckduck moose is a great company. they have really good apps. and yeah, "musicalme," vivianloves that, too. gina gurewitz: they're notvery good at it, though. mike phirman: as long as at theend of the game it comes up with a little thingthat says you are not very good at this.

jonathan coulton: yeah, it sayswhat are you, a child? paul sabourin: you'repretty stupid. kristen rutherford: anthropologically, you are stupid. mike phirman: paul or jonathan,any apps that you're crazy about, music-wise? paul sabourin: one of myfavorites is very simple-- "bebot." it's just a littleon-screen theremin with an adorable robot who sings as youmove your finger around.

and it's got a few differentsettings. but it's got multi-touch, so youcan play multiple notes. and it can lock into a certainscale, so you can't play a wrong note. you could just handit to a baby. and the baby will make music. that's kind of exciting. brett gurewitz: how doyou spell "bebot?" jonathan coulton: b-e-b-o-t.

brett gurewitz: and that'sit, one word? jonathan coulton:one word, yeah. brett gurewitz: cool. paul sabourin: i secondthat recommendation. i've had it for a long time, butnever even really touched it until recently. i've been playing around with,of all things, "garageband" for the ipad. which i found a lot more fun tomess around with than i had

been expecting. jonathan coulton: yeah,it's pretty crazy. it's kind of amazing whatyou can do with it. and it does have a lot of waysof playing music where you don't have to have a ton ofskill to make something that actually sounds pretty good. mike phirman: is "garage band"the one that has the little slider that you just like,how complex do you want your drumbeat?

and you're like, well,about that complex. kristen rutherford: oh my god. so i have a question foreverybody here, too. the question is, you can onlygive your child one album. jonathan coulton: oh, no. kristen rutherford: whatalbum do you give them? jonathan coulton: i guess mikephirman's album, probably. kristen rutherford: no, notthe kiss ass answer. mike phirman: i can't get to thesound effect fast enough.

gina gurewitz: whatdo you think? brett gurewitz: one albumfor their entire life? kristen rutherford:entire life. you can only gift them one albumand then you drop dead. brett gurewitz: all right,they're not to like it for a while, but i guess it'dbe "exile on main st." kristen rutherford:oh, interesting. brett gurewitz: yeah,sorry kids. you won't like this untilyou're older.

kristen rutherford: gina,you get to answer, too. what album would have? gina gurewitz: i don't know. i'm trying to think. kristen rutherford: would youlike us to come back to you? or would you like tothink about that? gina gurewitz: yeah. kristen rutherford: while you'reslowly hiding "exile on main st" someplace.

gina gurewitz: yeah, goto somebody else. let me think about it. mike phirman: paul? kristen rutherford:yeah, paul. paul sabourin: ah, me. does a greatest hitsalbum count? kristen rutherford:yeah, whatever. it could be anything. it's your kid, not mine.

paul sabourin: it's not avery creative answer. but you know the two "beatlesgreatest hits" ones? like, the old era andthe newer era one? kristen rutherford: yeah, thered one and the blue one. paul sabourin: probably theolder era "beatles greatest hits." kristen rutherford: that wasactually my first album that i bought with my own moneywas that one. jonathan coulton: i would sayprobably the "kenny g

christmas record." kristen rutherford: do youhate your children? jonathan coulton: just toteach them a lesson. mike phirman: but thenwhat will you have? kristen rutherford: toteach them a lesson. jonathan coulton: it would beinteresting if that was the only music you had ever heardin your entire life is the "kenny g christmas album." whatwould happen to you when you started playingother stuff?

you'd be like one ofthose kids raised by wolves, i think. jonathan coulton: | except you'd be raisedby kenny g. kristen rutherford: my parentswere not big music people. and when i sort of got oldenough, i was like, i'm going to go raid their albums. all they had was herb alpert andthe tijuana brass, which is awesome.

and a record about how to bellydance for your husband, which was mildly disturbing. jonathan coulton: wow. kristen rutherford: it'slike, that's it. mike phirman: with like, nowplace your right leg-- like that kind of thing? kristen rutherford: ididn't listen to it. i just quietly slid itback amongst all the other herb alperts.

jonathan coulton: boy, there'sa story behind that record, i bet. kristen rutherford: and idon't want to know it. paul sabourin: that's an entirejohn cheever short story in one album. mike phirman: i think i wouldgive him "the carl stalling project," just so he can runaround and do things through his whole life with just alittle bit of heightened entertainment.

i'm presuming if he getsone album, he doesn't get tv and all that. so this way he gets to livehis entertainment. gina gurewitz: i think"sgt. pepper's." kristen rutherford: yeah,"sgt. pepper's." gina gurewitz: that was an albumthat my parents had when i was a kid. and i remember my sister and iwould literally act out the entire album.

so it's something thatcan really stay with them from childhood. brett gurewitz: whodid that album? mike phirman: the monkees,i think, right? kristen rutherford:the bee gees. it was the bee gees. it was that movie withthem and andy gibb. mike phirman: that's what iwas trying to think of. brett gurewitz: wasn'tthat peter frampton?

kristen rutherford: peterframpton, yeah, it was peter frampton and aerosmith. aerosmith's on that album. brett gurewitz: that wasa terrible movie. why would you give them that? that movie was so terrible. jonathan coulton:the bee gees. the bee gees. kristen rutherford: that movieis like "star wars christmas

special," that movie. paul sabourin: really, it'stough to measure the mountains of cocaine that were being donebehind the scenes, just off-camera, sometimeson-camera. brett gurewitz: i'm goingto go watch that movie now that we-- paul sabourin: it's so awful. it's so terrible. mike phirman: i've neveractually seen it.

i've never seen it. and i wonder if i'll enjoy itbecause you guys are saying it's so bad. kristen rutherford:no, you will not. jonathan coulton: youwill not enjoy it. kristen rutherford: youwill not enjoy it. it's just like the "star warschristmas special" where you think this is going tobe ironic and fun. and then you spend the rest ofthe hour screaming and clawing

at your face tryingto get it to stop. mike phirman: thank you forsaving me that hour. kristen rutherford:you're welcome. i've saved you an hourof your life. that's a life debt. mike phirman: hey, so we'rekind of over time. i have more questions. or what are we doing? kristen rutherford: let's aska couple more questions and

then we'll-- mike phirman: ok, theseare personal wrap-up kind of things. things like, brett, this comesfrom milton fledgecow. kristen rutherford: you'remaking these names up. mike phirman: i'm not! twitter made them up. "any info on the upcomingbad religion album? that would be amazing."

brett gurewitz: yeah, there'snot really any info. mike phirman: and that's whyit would be amazing. brett gurewitz: hold on,i'll give a little bit. it's finished. we finally finished it. we finished mixing it. and we're making plans toannounce the release date and those sorts of things. paul sabourin: that's kind ofa lot of info, actually.

brett gurewitz: well, butthat's not any new info. paul sabourin: oh, ok. mike phirman: how hands-onare you, by the way, in the mixing stage? brett gurewitz: imixed the album. brett gurewitz: i mixed it. mike phirman: did you really? oh, cool. kristen rutherford: that'spretty hands-on.

kristen rutherford:that's awesome. brett gurewitz: i wrote a lotof it, played on a lot of it, mixed it. and i mixed it withjoe barresi. we'll be making an announcementabout the street date, and titles, and thingslike that in early november. mike phirman: ok, cool. you heard it herefirst, i think. brett gurewitz: yeah,that's true.

you heard that first. kristen rutherford: totallyheard that first. mike phirman: we've neverhad a story break. that's pretty cool. jonathan coulton: nicegoing, scoop. mike phirman: all right,on to jonathan. "is charlotte, north carolinagig still a go?" from warren. jonathan coulton: the charlotte,north carolina gig? i have to check myown website.

mike phirman: "are you touringso cal anytime soon?" laura asks. jonathan coulton: i am. i'm actually going to be in laon the 24th of november. and yeah, charlotte gig isstill on for december 6. actually that 24th isthe first show. i'm doing a tour all across thebottom part of the country in november, december. kristen rutherford: you're notimplying the underbelly.

you're just sayingthe bottom part? mike phirman: he's southern,you can just say. jonathan coulton: thebottom, the butt. mike phirman: the lesser part. jonathan coulton: thenation's butt. kristen rutherford:the nation's butt. mike phirman: "and where doyou get your hair done?" jordan carol wants to know. jonathan coulton:i go to a salon.

mike phirman: do you haveto check your website? jonathan coulton: i haveto check my website for that, too, yeah. i go to the same lady my wifegoes to, because i don't know how to make my own decisions. thanks. nice. "paul, can you be in sanfrancisco, san jose, or santa cruz again?" from--

paul sabourin: we wouldlove for it to be. mike phirman: any w00tstockupcoming plans? paul sabourin: nothingspecific. the problem is, for anyone whodoesn't know, w00tstock is this sort of variety show thatwe host with wil wheaton and adam savage. and the problem is getting wilwheaton and adam savage in the same city at the same timeavailable for a thing. jonathan coulton: because theyhate each other, right?

paul sabourin: well, theyhate each other. and they're very busy. and there's the blood feud. paul sabourin: but it's justvery difficult to get the four of us into a single setting. and to get people to be able tocommit that far out where we can put a venue and startmaking it happen. because they're showbusiness people who have very busy lives.

but it's not for lackof wanting. and we're hoping to havesome more coming up in the next year. mike phirman: nice. and daniel porter asks to all,"any australian tours in the works for anybody?" i would love to. i don't have anything planned. but some day i would really,really like to get there.

mike phirman: cool. well, you guys. kristen rutherford: thankyou to all of you. mike phirman: i think we'repretty much there, yeah. thank you so much. jonathan coulton:thank you, guys. kristen rutherford: before wego, i wanted to tell jonathan, when vivian was born, i sangthe "portal" song to her. jonathan coulton: oh, that'svery sweet, i guess.

paul sabourin: like, asshe was being born? as she was coming outof the portal? mike phirman: and theweird thing is, she came out of a wall. i shot a hole in the wallin blue and then orange. jonathan coulton: she fell fromthe ceiling to the floor, and then ceiling to floor,ceiling to floor. kristen rutherford: passing me,passing me, passing me, i don't know how to stop this.

jonathan coulton: that'svery sweet. i always like to hear that. i always like to think aboutpeople singing my songs to their children. it's heartwarming. mike phirman: i feel bad whensomebody will tell me that their kid listens to-- oh, welisten to "chicken monkey duck" every day. i'm like, awesome.

jonathan coulton: you knowwhat that means. mike phirman: well hey, youguys, thank you so much for coming on the show. and again, check out jonathancoulton.com, right, jonathan? that's probably the hub of yourstuff, i would imagine. jonathan coulton: yep, i justwent to that website. there's a lot of goodinformation there. kristen rutherford: you neededto check out what

your dates were, yes. mike phirman: so it'sstill up, good. and paul sabourin, what's thebest way to find you guys? paul sabourin: paulandstorm.comis good. mike phirman: paulandstorm.com,very good. and brett gurewitz, where couldpeople keep a tab on the next breaking news? brett gurewitz: theycould go do epitaph.com and also anti.com.

mike phirman: by the way, whenkristen said you were going to show, i was like epitaph, wheredid i just see that? and it's literally on my desk. right down here at the bottomit says epitaph. my buddy tony thaxton is thedrummer for a band on the-- brett gurewitz: yeah,that's right. long time epitaphartists, yeah. mike phirman: yeah, "motion citysoundtrack," good album. i feel like jay leno all ofa sudden, hey, motion city

soundtrack, good album. kristen rutherford: i totallyjust had a mom moment, a mom thing, where i was like and see,this is why you should be nice to everybody because youjust never know who's going to be watching. mike phirman: we do thisshow the second tuesday of every month. and do we know what the nextshow's going to be? kristen rutherford: so far thenext show is going to be

"geeks to be." and it shouldblair herter and jessica chobot who are expecting atiny geekling next year, unless something happens andthey aren't available. but that is what have plannedfor the next episode, for our thanksgiving episode. and this will goup on youtube. and you can leave commentsdown below. and you can fight about religionand all kinds of stuff down there.

kristen rutherford: and someonewill come on and say, why are you guys talking aboutyour kids on a parent show? get ready. mike phirman: in romney'samerica, no one would ever-- thank you guys very much forhanging out with us today. and i think that's it. kristen rutherford: that's it. bye, everybody. thank you.

brett gurewitz: thanksfor hanging out. kristen rutherford: bye, guys.